Information systems Security Degree

[10Dedfish]

Cheers!!

Ok guys, heres the poop. Im looking into a 4 Year Degree in Information systems Security. Its from ITT-tech and is also web based but you must have almost 60 credits in your core classes (english, math, humanities, etc.) before you are eligible. Has anyone heard anything about this program or ITT-tech in general?
For a course breakdown go to:
www.itt-tech.edu/campus/courses.cfm?prog_id=2002

Thanks guys,

10Ded

[stryder144]

Hey, man, I think it might be a little difficult to meet the computer requirements:

Minimum Requirements for Computer: Pentium II (min) 133 Mhz, 64K RAM, CD ROM Drive, 3.5" floppy disk drive, 1.2 GIG free space (master drive).

I'm thinking that if you can find a PII running at 133mhz native that you have found a specimen that needs to be preserved!

Anyway, it looks like a good program. I am looking into it now myself (I kind of like the thought of IS Security).

Cheers

[Schotty]

[quote author=10Dedfish link=board=14;threadid=6360;start=0#59979 date=1045133945]
Cheers!!

Ok guys, heres the poop. Im looking into a 4 Year Degree in Information systems Security. Its from ITT-tech and is also web based but you must have almost 60 credits in your core classes (english, math, humanities, etc.) before you are eligible. Has anyone heard anything about this program or ITT-tech in general?
For a course breakdown go to:
www.itt-tech.edu/campus/courses.cfm?prog_id=2002

Thanks guys,

10Ded
[/quote]

Avoid it if its like the 2 year IS program. I know a guy I can put you in a telephone conversation with. The 2 year program sucked == no degree, no certs just some half ass training and some useless hands on (useless because you have barely an idea). As for the EET stuff I took, I guess thats going down hill too, except for the BAS, which seems to be staying right where it was (pretty good, not superb, but pretty good).

[10Dedfish]

I talked to a couple of people today about it and they said pretty much the same thing. It was something along the lines of "build a lan at home and start trying to break into one from the other one. You will learn more and it will be cheaper in the long run". But, if I had time to do all of that I wouldnt be trying to find a college in the first place. oh well. :-\
10Ded

[Schotty]

I was kinda hoping it was just my area that was sliding downhill, but from what I was finding out -- its nationwide. If you got a DeVry, they are really good with electronics. Kinda hoped I went there. But the closest one to me is 100 miles away I dunno if they have a IT/IS program. They did have a programming course lat time I checked.

[Kernel_Killer]

I'm not so sure about the whole IT security degree thing. Security changes more often then the industry itself. I would say, go get a CIS degree, learn some PERL, C/C++, LISP, Java, HTML, ASM, and then study for CompTIA's Security+.

All you can do is keep up with security issues, and vulnerabilities. Of course networking is a required thing in this field, but you have that already.

[vvx]

Ofcourse, one has to wonder if a security+ really helps..

On the one hand, companies aren't going to hire someone with no computer experience to be their security guys. Not if they're smart anyway. So, then we've narrowed the selection down to people with a few years experience. Being a comptia certification, it's really basic. For these people with a few years experience, will the security+ make a meaningful difference on their resumes? Maybe. Maybe not. It's still to new to say I suppose.

[Kernel_Killer]

Ofcourse, one has to wonder if a security+ really helps..

Well, I guess you better read to material first b4 making a judgement.

It covers everything from hardening stand-alone systems, to domain servers in Win/Novell/UNIX, and how to point out serveral attacks like hijacking, replays, banner attacks, DDoS, and IP spoofing. Not to mention how this is done so you know if the files you are seeing are legit. That is just skimming the first 2 chapters of the 10 in the book. Nothing basic at all. No Win98 shit. If you don't know shit about intermediate networking, and intermediate hardware, you're screwed on this one.

As for it being really basic. Yes, the A+ is. Doesn't mean the other are. Looking good on ther resume? Well, yeah. So far, the jobs I've seen in St. Louis and KC are asking for them since they have found out that most people w/o them don't know wtf they are even doing.

If it was that poor of a certification, then I guess it would be really easy to crack into a .gov site, since they are the ones who ended up taking them first.

It's scary to notice how insecure your box really is when you notice you have ports braodcasting that you don't even know about. Win users beware!

[Schotty]

I have to say out of many of the certifications out there, the one that seems to stand out is CompTIA. Yes the A+ is easy, but that just states you can USE a computer instead of tyhe PC using you. Try taking the Security+, Linux+ or the Network+ and you will see that there are brains needed for these certs. I just hope RedHat is as demanding, and not like how the MCSE program (at least the NT4 ones) was.

And I dont believe in boot camps. They do nothing that teach you how to memorize answers, not troubleshooting skills. I felt obligated to chime THAT one in. The worst techs I have seen were ones that went to a day or two long session and then took the damn test.

[tolstoy]

Here's my 3 cents--

1) Web based education will never compare to actual classroom experience. I may get flamed for this, but it is what I believe.

2) If you really want to get involved in security, learn and get certified in an actual product (Checkpoint, CISCO PIX, etc), run a snort box, read a ton or books, get on the bugtraq mailing list. Read tcpdump output. F'around with Nessus, tripwaire, AD GPOs, and every other product on the market or in freeware. Stay on top of, and understand exploits, and etc.

3) Take a few classes, but don't waste your time on a whole program dedicated to the subject. Get an actual CS degree from a college rather than going to a technical institute. Getting a degree in IS security before you acutally have a degree in computers is like putting the cart before the horse, IMHO. IS security assumes a indepth knowledge of how most major OSes function and of how tcp/ip works at the packet-level. I know a lot of people in the industry who put up and maintain firewalls but have no idea what the tcp three-way handshake is or how to interpret their logs.

4) Look into the CISSP cert. To me, it seems like the most serious security cert, and also the hardest. You cannot even attempt it without 3 years provable experience in the computer securty field. Then, once obtained, you have to constantly maintain it by acheiving more industry certs (Checkpoint, PIX, etc), publishing works, reading books, teaching class, attending confrences, ect. This cert also assums that you are also familiar with incident handling, compuetr foresics, legal issues, and so on. So where do you get this experience -- read, read , read, experiment and work with actual products. Being a fully certified Checkpoint admin or staring at a snort console for a year will do far more for your career in the security industry than a degree on the topic will.