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Perpetual energy?
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Thread: Perpetual energy?

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  1. #1

    Perpetual energy?

    I have a theory for perpetual energy. There's probably something wrong with it or someone else would've already thought of this, but I'm going to try anyway. Suppose you had a huge loop out in space. It is made of segments of magnetite, providing alternating magnetic poles along the surface without the use of energy. Now imagine a vehicle built to run along the inside of it (or outside will work too). It will have wheels and rocket engines for initial acceleration, but these can later be disregarded. It will have an inductor along the bottom of it to generate electricity from the alternating magnetic fields. It will also have an electromagnet to oppose the magnets beneath it, therefore keeping the vehicle just barely above its track. The method of transferring energy to external systems is irrelevant, although it could be done using electromagnetic radiation (radio waves or lasers or something).

    The theory behind this lies in centripetal acceleration. Given a certain speed, necessary centripetal acceleration decreases as the size of the circle increases. Likewise, a larger circle requires less centripetal acceleration for a given speed. For a circle the size of Earth, you would have to travel about 55,000 km/h before 1 g of centripetal acceleration would be necessary. Obviously if you're passing by magnets at that speed, you should be able to build up enough energy to repel yourself at that acceleration. And there should be left over for gaining more speed and transferring to external sources. So am I missing something here or should this work?

    By the way, I'm not looking for the pheasibility of the project. I know there's probably not enough magnetite on Earth to build such a loop and even if there was, we wouldn't be able to build it. I just want to know if it's theoretically possible.

  2. #2
    Guest

    Re: Perpetual energy?

    I dont think it will work. The electomagnet on the bottom of the moving vehicle would eventually overcome the acceleration due to the friction caused by it opposing the fields along the track.

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    338

    Re: Perpetual energy?

    Its OPPORTUNITY
    is that magnetite will NOT put out an alternating field.
    its DC only.
    So power everything you wnt
    off of DC + magntite provides plenty of that.
    Imagine building a demo project of a 3' (1 meter) in diameter

  4. #4

    Re: Perpetual energy?


    I dont think it will work. The electomagnet on the bottom of the moving vehicle would eventually overcome the acceleration due to the friction caused by it opposing the fields along the track.
    I've already thought of that. Not only will the electromagnet provide centrifugal acceleration for the vehicle, it will also provide acceleration. As it is passing the first half of a certain pole, the electromagnet will only be mildly charged. This will keep the permanent magnet from attracting the metal in the electromagnet but won't have much other effect on the vehicle. (Because of ferromagnetism, it wouldn't instantly reach full magnetism anyway.) After reaching the halfway point, the electromagnet will be charged much more. This way, while the repulsion of the pole it's over will provide centripetal acceleration, it will also be attracted to the next pole, providing rotational acceleration. Since the repulsion strength will be greater, the vehicle won't be sucked into the next pole. Therefore the mild amount of magnetic friction should be overcome. The electromagnet would just need to be made of something that can reach full magnetic charge very quickly and have advanced computers onboard.

  5. #5

    Re: Perpetual energy?


    Its OPPORTUNITY
    is that magnetite will NOT put out an alternating field.
    its DC only.
    So power everything you wnt
    off of DC + magntite provides plenty of that.
    Imagine building a demo project of a 3' (1 meter) in diameter
    The magnetite field would not be alternating. The vehicle would be passing through the field, just as the wires in an alternator do. That's why you need something to start the vehicle off, like rocket engines. After it reaches a certain speed, it seems like it would be self-sustaining.

    Also, I've thought of a slightly different approach. Instead of using electromagnetism for centripetal acceleration, you would have a wire tied to a rotating pivot in the center of the loop. It would hold the vehicle slightly off the magnets while providing a better way for the energy to be transferred to external targets. It would either keep the electromagnet for acceleration or there would be a motor in the pivot. In this case, the weight of the vehicle wouldn't affect the efficiency like in the last one. Instead, friction in the pivot would come to play. And with a large loop, it could take several seconds or minutes to do one revolution.

  6. #6

    Re: Perpetual energy?


    I just want to know if it's theoretically possible.
    The second law of thermodynamics tells you that it's not theoretically possible. All processes are inefficient. The electromagnetism experts could tell you how.

  7. #7

    Re: Perpetual energy?


    The second law of thermodynamics tells you that it's not theoretically possible. All processes are inefficient. The electromagnetism experts could tell you how.
    Well get them in here then because I want to know.

  8. #8

    Re: Perpetual energy?

    You know who you remind me of? Chances are pretty good that it's nobody you know, but he was a friend of mine back in highschool. One day we sat down together, and out of pure boredom we came up with a planetary transit system that would be a hell of a lot faster than anything we currently have. Strangely enough it was based on a very similar concept to your energy loop. I tell ya...magnetism's where it's at!

  9. #9

    Re: Perpetual energy?

    Isn't magnetism used for the bullet trains in Japan? That would mean it's quite similar to my design.

  10. #10

    Re: Perpetual energy?

    I'm pretty sure the bullet trains in japan don't actually generate power, though...

    Also, your magnetite will wear down after some time... the little opposing electro magnet will eventually reduce the magnetism to nothing. And anything that hits the magnetite will reduce it's magnetism as well. So will heat.

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